Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

Post Number:#1  Post by ofonorow » Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:11 am

Mr. Fonorow,

My name is [female - deleted]. I'm 52 and generally very healthy. I've been using Cardio C since Oct. 6, 2016. Prior to this date, I've taken NO supplements, but for inconsistent VitaD3, trying to eating right, often organic, and mostly gluten free. I stay active, used to run, and now walk. I started the "prevention" regime suggested (Pauling heart healthy supplements) and 1scoop Cardio C dosage (id#14205) after learning that I had the beginning stages of soft plaque in my right carotid artery--about 20%. Peripheral and other areas, checked clean to the extent it can be measured (ultra sounds, etc.) We've had an unbelievably stressful past three years (deaths, significant family illnesses/surgeries, and court proceedings related to one of the deaths).

In December, I've started having significant heart racing, skips, cramping, etc., warranting a trip to the ER--they found nothing, but that I was slightly low in potassium--which we think is corrected, pending blood test. I've added magnesium (topical and oral supplements) as my research indicated I had nearly every sign of deficiency, including the heart racing, irregular beats, anxiety and insomnia related to worry about my heart). It seems to have helped to some degree. I'm working with Boone Heart Institute and CU Health Sciences to rule out any mechanical issues. I do have mild mitral and tricuspid valve regurgitations and have had that monitored for 14 years. No fluid build-up. The soft plaque is still there, but not growing.

In my research, I see that Lysine competes with arginine--possibly constricting, causing arteries to cramp. Plus, everything I'm reading says not to take it long term. Needless to say, I'm concerned. The cardiologists don't give any of it much weight, but have not brushed it off either. They are just tolerating my objection to medicating every symptom--until we have all the testing back.

Wondering if in order to keep my Vita C levels up... (2500-3000mg, daily), you would suggest just the l-ascorbic powder, eliminating lysine--obviously keeping it in my diet (meat, salmon, yogurt, cheese), and take the 500 mg of proline?

Looking for guidance.

Thanks!


Well Pauling therapy is best received in heart patients, usually with severe disease. I think you are smart to take it as a preventive, especially after a diagnosis of "mild plaque build-up." But given what you described, it makes sense to focus on vitamin C and perhaps drop the amino acids and see how you feel? (Let us know.) I would keep supplementing vitamin C, along with the other supplements Pauling advised in HOW TO LIVE LONGER AND FEEL BETTER (1986), i.e. Vitamin E, A, B-complex, Multi, and lots of water/no sugars.)

In my research, I see that Lysine competes with arginine--possibly constricting, causing arteries to cramp. Plus, everything I'm reading says not to take it long term


We've tried to look into "research" like this and find very little. Much like a rumor. The "competition" is apparently in the gut - where both arginine and lysine "compete" for the tubules into the blood stream. So the answer is to generally take high doses separately. There also may be some interactions inside the cell, but nothing that would affect most people. Perhaps you are different?
Owen R. Fonorow
HeartCURE.Info
American Scientist's Invention Could Prevent 350,000 Heart Bypass Operations a year

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Re: Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

Post Number:#2  Post by Johnwen » Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:46 am

Since this lady already is showing signs of plaque build up it would NOT be advisable to stop the lysine.

However Like Owen said it would be prudent to space the two supplements apart by say 4-6 hours and reap the protective benefits of both.
Lysine does not constrict the arteries but it does compete with Arginine for cellular transport into the cells and lysine is the dominate element in this competition so it will blunt the benefits of Arginine.

Also at her age she probably is deficient in D3. We have discussed this many times that the best supplement she should be taking is the combination of D3 & K2 (MK7).

The valvular leakage! It would be a good idea at this point to also add a 81Mg Baby Aspirin once a day as a prophylactic to keep the blood from clumping, just in case there is some turbulence/cavitations occurring especially in stressful situations.

Here’s a link mostly on Arginine and also how lysine competes with it.

http://jn.nutrition.org/content/137/6/1662S.full

Hope this helps! :)
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Re: Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

Post Number:#3  Post by Joanna45 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:54 am

Johnwen
I'm 71 and using heart tech from tower labs and along with L- Lysine it has proline 400mg and Arginine 200mg and have been on it since late July I had 48% narrowing of the mesenteric artery and the same with the mesenteric celiac artery. All other arteries were clear.. I was getting really bad gut pain directly after eating..and that was resolved in about a week after starting Pauling therapy..had bad fatigue all when excercising and can do regular routine again ..should I be worried about the proline..
Thanks
Joanna

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Re: Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

Post Number:#4  Post by Johnwen » Fri Jan 06, 2017 11:02 am

Simple answer about Proline “NO!”
Proline is a amino acid that your body produces and has no known side effects when taken in moderation, Which 400Mg. Is well below what would be considered moderate.

There is NO RDA for it either!

From reading your report I won’t worry about heart tech or Cardio-C and worry more about what your eating and getting the proper amount and type of exercise. Most of the intestinal artery problems seen are usually caused by lack of movement primarily sitting for long hours or eating then extended sitting periods after.
From what you reported it sounds like you hit the nail on the head, so just keep doing what your doing and don’t skip your Pauling therapy not even for a single day!
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Re: Healthy, New to PT, (Using as preventive) Thinks things may be going sideways

Post Number:#5  Post by Joanna45 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:31 pm

Thanks Johnwen
I have been walking every day and work out with weights also ..live in the east and ski quite often and snowshoeing .and over all my diet is really good .eat mostly Whole Foods and local foods fortunately I live in Vermont so have farmers markets and co-ops everywhere ..so was surprised when this happened to me. I always have been active all my life and have never been overweight..
Thanks for the info
Joanna


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