Glucose Modulates Vitamin C Transport

[Saw]

I am able to raise BT from around 3grams to around 8 grams with homemade lypo. I suspect it's due to lack of full encapsulation and that is why there is still a BT level that's hit.

Very nice! I like your theory and it coincides nicely with the approximate estimate of 70% encapsulation for homemade lypo.

[ofonorow]

BTW, lipo c has higher BT not because it is absorbed more, but because it has different digestion route and is 100% absorbed in small intestines via lymphatic channels as chylomicron.

I have tried several times to parse this sentence... "not because it is absorbed more"?? Usually absorbed refers to digestion?

The phenomenon of bowel tolerance seems to be related to how much vitamin C reaches the rectum.

In my experience, Lypo-C (real, persistent, functional nano particles) seems to have very little gas and diarrhea issues. However as Dr. Levy points out, even using the proper phospholipids - that create the sustainable nano "bubbles" - not all the C is encapsulated. Some of the non-encapsulated C will also be absorbed/protected, but it seems eventually even with Lypo-C, you can probably hit bowel tolerance.

The Homemade liposomal, using the inferior bubble maker - lecithin - seems to cause bowel tolerance issues, at a higher intake than ordinary C, but a lower intake than fully liposomal Lypo-C. This seems consistent with the idea that the vitamin is protected from degradation during the digestive process when it is emulsified, so there is value to the homemade lipo - and probably, more gets inside cells as the experiments with aloe vera and kiwi gel show.

But as I was reminded by a patient at my alt. doc's clinic last Saturday, lecithin is wonderful for the heart, and I had forgotten that there are intrevenous licithin products being marketing for CVD in Europe.

[majkinetor]

I have tried several times to parse this sentence... "not because it is absorbed more"?? Usually absorbed refers to digestion?

Sorry, my english sux some some time. I meant that the lack of BT with lipos is consequence of different digestion process comparing to powder form of vitamin C.

[jaamzg]

As far as I know DHA is excreted. So cell can take AA via SVCT, it gets oxidised to DHA which then gets excreted out via GLUT.

See this pic
http://www.biocarta.com/pathfiles/m_vitcbpathway.asp

Thanks, this picture makes much more sense to me than the original picture from the Journal of Nutrition you had linked to at the beginning of the topic http://jn.nutrition.org/content/130/1/63/F7.expansion.html

In the biocarta.com link it shows the AA going straight through into the blood stream as AA and not being taken up as DHA and then reduced. It then shows it going into cells and having the OH stripped and the DHA leaving the cell. The site says:

.The vitamin C imported from the intestine is present in plasma at approximately 50 uM, almost exclusively in the reduced form, and is transported to tissues to play a variety of roles. Svct2 imports reduced ascorbate from the plasma into very active tissues like the brain. Deletion in mice of the gene for Svct2 revealed that ascorbate is required for normal development of the lungs and brain during pregnancy. A high concentration of vitamin C in neurons of the developing brain may help protect the developing brain from free radical damage. The oxidized form of ascorbate, dehydroascorbic acid, is transported into a variety of cells by the glucose transporter Glut-1. Glut-1, Glut-3 and Glut-4 can transport dehydroascorbate, but may not transport significant quantities of ascorbic acid in vivo.

So, if this is correct, and AA is transported via Svct2 and not Glut, then I suspect the chances that Chromium would have any beneficial effect on increasing the movement of AA into cells is a bit lower. I haven't found any definitive information on how Chromium increases glucose sensitivity, so it's still a possibility.

I'll experiment on myself over the next few weeks and report back with any findings.

[majkinetor]

So, if this is correct, and AA is transported via Svct2 and not Glut, then I suspect the chances that Chromium would have any beneficial effect on increasing the movement of AA into cells is a bit lower.

There is nothing here that disputes value of Chromium regarding to bioavailablity of vitamin C.

When there is some form of cellular stress, free radicals are usually involved. Those will quickly oxidise vitamin C to DHA and its concentration will be higher. In some disease states ratio of AA/DHA could be as low as 0.7, while it is normally very high (can't remember exact number but somewhere around 10 or 15). On such locations, given enough GLUT receptors and insulin sensitivity DHA will probably be recycled faster.

Since Cr also helps in diabets by reducing insulin resistance and blood glucose levels, according to initial post where scientists show that glucose blocks SVCT from the inside of the cell, it can be concluded that SVCT receptors will be more efficient.

Also, it makes logical sense - vitamin C and glucose are very similar - C is made from Glu, both use GLUT receptors, both influence insulin levels and so on - it certainly does make sense that achieving optimal control of one will influence another.