My PT Journal (stroke)

[farside]

All the evidence shows that Pauling Therapy (PT) has the following attributes:

1. At full dosage, PT will reverse arterial plaque, but SLOWLY - I estimate 0.1mm reduction in thickness per month.
2. For coronary heart disease (CHD), the arteries are small so full dosage PT can unblock them in about 3 to 9 months.
3. For blockages of larger vessels (e.g. carotids), it will take about 3 years to clear, if over 50% blocked.
4. Once unblocked, half dose PT will keep them unblocked.

So those with CHD (at risk of heart attack) may need ~6 months to get cured by PT.
Those with other blocked arteries (e.g. carotids, at risk of stroke) may need ~3 years to get cured by PT.

I believe the above is accurate. If so, it needs to be brought to the attention in a sticky right at the front of this forum.

The one article that flies in the face of this conclusion is this one:
This guy managed to, in one year, completely remove a 100% carotid blockage using 1/7 the dose of my PT regime! Here:
http://vitamincfoundation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=11053#p34124

So what was different in that case? Carotids have similar sizes, and I find it hard to believe it is just genetics (fast blockage -> fast unblockage?).
I suspect it may have something to do with the lecithin supplement he took. Lecithin (and acetyl-carnitine) both stimulate TMAO production, which damages arteries, unless some protective factor is present (Vit C?).

For those that can't risk long treatment times, the following accelerants appear most promising (and have scientific evidence to support them):
DMSO (oral / topical)
Pomegranate juice
Chondroitin sulphate
Removal of senescent cells (e.g with 100uM Azithromycin)

[pamojja]

I believe the above is accurate. If so, it needs to be brought to the attention in a sticky right at the front of this forum.

Not at all. If that would be true, then quitting PT wouldn't be that dangerous.

Also we don't have any representative sample on PT which consistently showed CAC-score reduction.

The only other community which does consistently track CAC score is the old TrackYourPlaque. Even there only a few accomplish any reversal. However, there it has been the experience just the slow-down of calcification growth below 15%, and no more future cardiovascular events. Consistent with our experience: never stop PT if you want to avoid future events.

One risk for TMAO is TMAO metabolising gut-bacteria. Which I gladly don't have.

[farside]

I believe my statements are accurate because they are supported by my experience, your experience and the experience of Linus Pauling's test subject, and by those with coronary issues mentioned in this forum.

No one is suggesting stopping PT.
That would simply allow blockages to progess to their fatal conclusion.

The issue is that, for carotids, simply stopping progression isn't enough (a person has already had a stroke, so what is stopping another if the blockage remains as is?). PT will SLOWLY remove the blockage (as you have testified), but during that time people are still at risk. People with carotid blockages should be told on the outset that PT is slow, and if time is a factor, additional therapies need to be applied as well to accelerate the unblocking process.

The exception is in the case I referred to (100% blockage removal) that seems to be short of miraculous and I would like to understand why that case was so effective.

[pamojja]

PT will SLOWLY remove the blockage (as you have testified), but during that time people are still at risk.

In my case CIMT decreased in the end, while with an additional chronic bronchitis before it even increase with a 20% yearly rate. Nothing to do with my main stenosis at my abdominal aorta bifurcation, remaining the same. Since 0,9mm reduction in the carodit doesn't mean anything in the aorta with approx. 2 cm diameter, and a 80% stenosis.

And even if calcification increases at a 15% yearly rate on therapy, they are still not at risk.

supported by my experience, your experience and the experience of Linus Pauling's test subjects

Not supported by my experience, or the experience of anyone on the TrackYourPlaque forum - which do serial CAC score meassurments. And almost nobody does here, including you. Please point me to the paper of Pauling's with sufficient test subjects, so that I can see for myself with which diagnositic means the reduction of arterial plaque was meassured.

Such ignorant claims are really harming the reputation of PT.

[farside]

Please point me to the paper of Pauling's

Case Report: Lysine/Ascorbate-Related
Amelioration of Angina Pectoris
Linus Pauling

One study/person, but the most famous and quoted one.

serial CAC score

I don't have major calcification. And calcification only represents 20% of the total plaque volume, so isn't useful.

please let's be gentlemen and not resort to ad-hominen attacks. No-one has all the answers, thta's why this forum exists.

[pamojja]

I think critical discussion is very helpful, and for that certain behavior has to be pointed out. Ad-hominem attacks, on the other hand, is attacking the character of the person itself (ie. not the behavior is pointed out as ignorant, but the person itself). Und usually occures when no more rational arguments are left. Which I didn't, nor intented to. Sorry for your misunderstanding.

In my case anginal-like chest-pains already ceased with a sufficient CoQ10 dose alone. Doesn't meant any calcification decreased.

It's true that calcium presents only about 20% of total plaque volume. And because of that it is exactly very helpful in assessing the extent of total plaque, or its regression. If one didn't had a CAC-score - one simply can't know if one has major calcification in the coronaries. Calcification in the extremitees can be assessed with MRI, or ultra-sound. Similiar to the carotid. But either of these plaque-free doesn't neccesarily mean no plaque anywhere else.

by my experience, your experience and the experience of Linus Pauling's test subject

You meassured only CIMT, which reversed. From that you can't conclude there isn't any plaque anywhere else.
I meassured CIMT and my aorta stenosis, the first reversed, the later didn't. In my case the remission of my walking-disabilty due to that 80% aorta stenosis was effected be revascularisation alone.
Pauling's case report didn't meassure anything, and therefore can't be taken to mean Plaque reversal.

[farside]

Just for the record, I have taken PT for nearly 8 months now (using ~20g VC per day) and will continue at this therapeutic dose until my carotid clears.
After that, I will use half dosage for maintenance.

You meassured only CIMT, which reversed.

If you are referring to my case, this isn't true. No discernable change was observed after 6 months. I am assuming PT is working, just too slowly for the ultra sound to detect an observable change.
In the scan, I was able to see the carotid blockage very clearly.
Incidentally, eDOC paints a poor picture of PT in

In my clinical experience without DMSO PT is incomplete, neither can it decrease atherosclerotic deposits, reduce calcium content/score, decease or render lpas invalid in a short span.......besides repairing many other Cardiovascular deficits.
eDOC!!

http://vitamincfoundation.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=57823#p57823

I am continuing on with PT and adding anything else that can help.
Recently I have started to drink about 15ml of 50% DMSO when taking the PT. I also apply DMSO topically on the neck.
As a new experiment, I have mixed DMSO with an antibiotic that kills senescent cells and applied that to my neck as well.
I am also consuming a lot of pomegranate juice!

Finally, after a long time not taking, I have resumed taking DHEA, melatonin and pregnenolone, after re-reading an old super-hormone book. These are definitely helping the feel good factor!

[DiverDown2]

farside, have you ever considered taking Pomegranate Extract instead of so much Pomegranate Juice which has 32.7 grams of carbohydrates (31.5 grams of sugar and 0.2 grams of fiber) in 8 oz.

[pamojja]

Incidentally, eDOC paints a poor picture of PT

eDOC admitted to only accepting fast results, therefore he never hat the circumspection and patience to give the whole PT a fair trial.

[farside]

have you ever considered taking Pomegranate Extract instead of so much Pomegranate Juice

Good point DiverDown2.
I'll look at the pricing. Money is tight and I aleady have too many pills to swallow!
Have you had any success yourself with this?

[pamojja]

I took pomegranate extract along with PT. Long ago I read pomegranate extracts standartized to punicalins would be most effective. Since only found vitacost with a 250 mg capsules, and LEF with 500 mg capsules, and an effective dose at least somewhere above 700 mg/d, that indeed can get costly. All other pomegranate extracts on the market are usually standartized on ellagic acid, and would be more affordable.

[farside]

Thanks pamojja. Indeed, I recall the effective ingredient in pomegarante is puninic acid and related compounds.
Maybe there is a sugar absorber (like there are fat absorbers) that can be taken with the pomegranate juice?

Edit: from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punicic_acid

Punicic acid makes up around 65% of the fatty acids in pomegranate seed oil.

I'm sure one can get the ground seeds quite cheaply, so I'll investigate this.

[pamojja]

Ellagic acid standartized extracts are interesting too, since with the right gut bacteria, if I remember right Gordonibacter, it is metabolized into urotholin A.

Of course with real pomegranate or its juice one can't go wrong. I would however too precaution to meassure the blood-glucose spike, and adjust the dose downward, if there is too much of a glucose spike.

[farside]

Anardana Powder is ground pomegranate seed (cheap to buy) but I think (?) it includes the pulp as well, so may be loaded with sugar.
It is possible to get cold pressed pomegranate seed oil (pressed from the pip), but its expensive.
Can you say more about 'urotholin A' ?

[pamojja]

A lot of links to more information: https://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/1 ... -released/

I usually don't pay much attention myself when I can't afford, or simply don't have certain gut bacteria.

Where is Anardana Powder available? The question about sugar is always easily settled with a cheap blood-glucose monitor.